A Quandary: Advice Requested

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

I'll put this behind a cut since it is tech support related, but not a rant or funny story.

A queue manangement position has opened at my work.  Should I apply for it?

Relevant points:

I'm 28, I am the primary support for my family which includes an infant son, and we are doing OK monetarily right now.  I have a bachelor's in theatre and a master's in corporate communication and technology.  I'm good at presentations, teaching, face-to-face stuff.  I love writing.  The fact that I know anything about computers is not due to any studies I've pursued, but is merely incidental.  I am most suited to working in the communications department here at my company, but since I am in tech support, they will not hire me, thinking that I am a moron.

I've been trying to get out of Tier I tech support into another department at this company for pretty much the entire three and a half years I've been here.  I was told that people tend to move on in 6-12 months after being hired.  Well, that didn't turn out to be true.  I was told that getting my master's would make a difference.  Well, that didn't turn out to be true either.  I have been recently told in all seriousness that I may need to try to get my doctorate before I can get off the phones.  (???)

I don't want to stay in tech support.  I've been doing it for five years and I love my coworkers but I can't stand the work. 

Half of me is saying, "Oh, just apply for the position, it'll be less phone time, it's management, and it's more money.  And you'll never get out of the helpdesk anyway."

The other half is saying, "No, there's still hope!  There's still hope that one day, maybe in a few years, you can have a job you will enjoy!"

Other relevant fact:  Since it's more money, it would put me in a higher pay grade, and that makes it much harder to get out of the helpdesk, since there are far fewer jobs posted at that pay level or higher.  However, I have been rejected for every job I've applied for at my current pay grade anyway.  The reason is usually "candidate not minimally qualified"--most of the jobs require only a bachelor's degree, so I don't know why I get that, but whatever.

Anyway, what would you guys do in my position?

Sorry for the downer post, but I'm really interested in the community's input--more money, less mobility, what matters to you guys?

Comments

[valancy17.livejournal.com]

Apply for the job and see what happens. Why talk yourself out of a job you haven't even been offered? What harm could it do to apply? If they don't even interview you, you'll be no worse off than you are now, and it'll strengthen your resolve to get the hell out of there.

If they do and they offer you the job, then remember that no job lasts forever and even if you take it, it won't be for the rest of your life.

The exception would be if this is a job you would refuse to do even if they offered you the job and fringe benefits and extra money. In that case, don't bother applying. Otherwise, can't hurt to try, but don't get your hopes up.

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

It's not that I don't think I could get the job (I might be able to)--more that I'm not sure it wouldn't put me in an even less easy-to-get-out-of position than I'm in now. :(

The job is difficult and irritating (I know people in it now) but no more difficult and irritating than the one I currently have. :)

Houdini

[valancy17.livejournal.com]

I know where you're coming from on the 'easy to get out of' thing, but in the end, every job can be easy to get out of, depending on your attitude. I mean, you want to be a nice person and everything, but you have to do what's best for you, in the end. The more I tried to say about it, the more I thought it's like breaking up with someone. 'No hard feelings, this just isn't working out.' is a perfectly acceptable and reasonable reason to get out of a position.

If it's no more difficult and irritating than your current job, and you'd be getting more money (which you could use to start a college fund for that baby or buy shiny new toys or save for retirement or whatever), why not do it?

Re: Houdini

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

Wow--you're totally right. You have convinced me! Voilà, I have thrown my hat in the ring. We shall see what (if anything) it avails me. I will let you all know.

Thanks for the assistance, Melissa, and everyone else!

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

Thanks. I was a little confused by the whole thing re: the degree, because you're right, most of my coworkers have AA degrees, if that. NOT that I am saying that education makes a person smart. I certainly get enough calls from people with doctorates to know that isn't the case. heh.

The corp. I work at right now is roughly 130,000 employees. However, if any of the hiring managers see "tech support" on your resume, they run in the other direction. Actually, they just assume you didn't really mean to apply for the job they have available. They think that if you work in tech support, that must be what you intended to do with your life, and that you cannot possibly have any aspirations past that.

I used to wonder why my company spent over $20 grand giving me the master's degree (we have tuition reimbursement, yay) since they're not making use of it, but then I realized that they did it purely to fuel my self-esteem. So I guess that's nice of them.

[valancy17.livejournal.com]

I have a master's too, and I used to work for a university. I decided there's an inverse relationship between education and common sense. The higher level degree you have, the less common sense you have, and vice versa. :)

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

Man, I NEED to get my Ph.D. then. I have always wondered what it would be like to be too dumb to come in out of the rain! hee!

[toxico.livejournal.com]

There's no harm in trying for more dough, even if you're still looking in the meantime. So why not do both?

Another thing to consider is whether the position requires travel. Would the time away from your family be worth the extra kick-in-the-bank?

Nothing wrong with seeing where applying gets you. You can always elect to turn down an offer, should you get one, and remain where you are if you get cold feet.

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

That's a good point. And no, it requires no travel. The only thing it does require that is at all out of the ordinary is that about one week a month I'd have to carry around the helpdesk cell phone and take calls from people who are calling in sick. They do call at all hours. *sigh*

[jecook]

My god, three and a half years on the hell desk?

You poor soul. No one deserves that kind of torment.

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

Three and a half years at this company. A year and a half before that at Dell (before they outsourced my job to India) and at various ISPs and webmail support.

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

Actually, my first job was as a production manager at the city opera. *snicker*

[infy.livejournal.com]

I remember getting that same kind of guarantee when I started where I am. It's been four years now and I'm under the impression that I'll completely have to leave the company (and go back to consulting) to get another job in a different area.

What do they mean by "queue management"?

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

It's what they call a "coordinator" position. We have several groups of Tier I analysts here. For example, I am in the email/remote access queue. Some queues are for certain business areas within our company, and some, like mine and mainframe, are for certain types of issues. This would be basically a team lead position (not really a manager--I wouldn't do performance reviews but would have input on them) for one of the queues.

[the-s-guy.livejournal.com]

Three and a half?

Try eight.

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

Nobody deserves any time at all on it.

[kalidor.livejournal.com]

My Advice .. go for it. If nothing else you can always look elsewhere later and say you have managment experience.

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

True... although I already have management experience. My first job out of college was as a production manager for the city opera. But nobody looks that far down my resume. Might be time, as you say, to bump it back up in the ranks.

[xdownfornowx.livejournal.com]

apply for the job and take it if offered. Its more money and you'll be in a better spot with less phone time (DUH!!!). Then after you've had the title "manager" for a while shop your resume around companies. You'll be certain to get a better job somewhere with management expirience and a masters. My job searches were fruitless untli I scored a position as "Network Administrator" and now I get a bunch of call backs from companies that find my resume. There is a lot in a title, it shitty thats the way it has to be, but thats how the corarate world works.

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

Yeah, I guess for the title and all that it would help. I'm just afraid that if I take a helpdesk management position I'll never be able to get any other type of management position. Because let's face it, as little respect as tech support gets, tech support managers get little respect as managers.

[marahsk.livejournal.com]

So basically you are choosing between two jobs that suck equally, but one pays more than the other and carries a title that looks good on your resume? I'm not seeing the dilemma, myself. You are clearly not going to get a new job within your company (per your post), so reducing your non-existent chances of transfering jobs won't make any actual difference to you. Apply for the new job, take it if it's offered to you, and start looking outside your company if you're serious about wanting to change jobs. And good luck!

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

You're right; I guess I was just grabbing onto the last residual vestiges of hope that someday I might be able to transfer to a more worthwhile job at the company (most people I have worked with at the helpdesk have been able to do this, and most do not have their master's).

But that's silly. Well, now that I've decided to apply, I hope I get it, 'cause if I don't, then I'm going to feel bad all over again.

Hmm, better work on that self-esteem problem!

[marahsk.livejournal.com]

Well, if most people have transfered to a better job, but you are being continually rejected as being unqualified, there are several possibilities: either someone doesn't like you, your resume fails to show your qualifications, or you are missing some qualification they are looking for. Is there a supervisor, maybe even someone involved in hiring, who you would feel comfortable asking in what way you were unqualified for [whatever job you previously applied for]? The answer should give you a hint as to which of the 3 it is. If it's the first, you will probably have to change companies, but if it's one of the other two, it's fixable.

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

I ask every person who rejects me for a job and I have had several conversations here with managers (my own and others) and with HR. I have been told I lack server administration experience. Well, first of all, I don't necessarily want to be a server administrator, and second of all, we are not permitted to gain experience in server administration. Grr.

I do need to punch up my resume some more, I guess. But job prospects in this company are really locked down--they would always, always prefer to bring someone in from the outside than to hire internally.

[marahsk.livejournal.com]

Then find another company that also prefers to bring in people from the outside. ;)

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

None will even give me the time of day, because I am "only in Tier I tech support" so there must be something wrong with me, right?

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

so true on the tech. experience thing!

They don't do it so much here; all the managers here started where I am now. But my previous job, where I was taking calls for Dell? Yep, managers who wouldn't know a keyboard from their own butt. Ugh.

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

I worked for an outsourced company, so I made about half what you did. ;)

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

And no, it wasn't Stream!

[(Anonymous)]

Back in "The Day" there wasn't any outsourcing, except with the on-site repair guys...whatever they were called. Beltek or something? All the customer service and tech support areas were all internal to Dell at the time, so I'm not familiar with any contracting companies.

When I left, I was working for the Med Business division in Sales Operations. :) And I really didn't make all that much money.

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

It wasn't much of a day. ;) I worked on the Dell account at my contracting company from 2000-2001. At that time, they had just begun outsourcing to India for $2 an hour, and were starting people at my company at $7 an hour, and at that time, we understood that the people at Round Rock itself were making about $15 an hour.

[geekgrrl-ca.livejournal.com]

Stream certainly has a reputation...

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

I'm sure there were some lovely people there.

I just happened to get a lot of hosed-&-closed clients who would call back very upset. You know, in the vein of, "You guys told me that I should call AOL for this hardware error with my modem and now I will HAVE YOUR JOB!!@#!11"

Well

[edgeofentropy.livejournal.com]

The only thing you have to loose is your pride and you got to that at the Opera...Go for it. If you must be in hell, at least get the most pay possible out of it, besides it's hardly a resume stain...

Re: Well

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

The Opera seemed like a good idea at the time, but it really was killer, wasn't it?

[jonyoon.livejournal.com]

Nothing ventured, nothing gained. You've probably been through the "where do you see yourself in 5 years" crap, so you know what you need to do. Plus, even though you are going to still be in a helpdesk role, by moving into a higher position - you'll be taking on more complex responsibilities that can easily be transitioned into other non-helpdesk roles.

Good luck.

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

Thank you!

Unfortunately, I've never been too good at the where do I see myself in five years thing. Because I've always wanted my answer to be "successful author" or "in Hollywood" and the fact that I'm plodding along in a nowhere tech support job kind of gives that the lie.

[jjjiii]

Apply for opportunities with other companies.

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

I've been doing that as well--have yet to even garner a "f*ck off" email, which wouldn't cost them so much as a stamp or any cell phone minutes.

PHD?

[255-255-255-0.livejournal.com]

You need a phD to get out of tier 1 !!!!!!

Neary EVERY person I have ever met who works on phones doesn't even have a college certificate!
Go for the job and get more money while you look for work in ANOTHER company I would say.

I have a Hons Degree and feel undervalued doing support. Not BECAUSE I have a degree but because I know I can achieve a lot more than, "No, Click that one".

But that's my problem your teir one thing sounds like thay are messing you about.

Re: PHD?

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

Well, they do seem to be right, at least about the degree thing--not that I would need a Ph.D. to get out of Tier I in general, but that I would need one to get out at this company. Yes, many people with bachelor's degrees have gotten out, but there are also a few people, like me, stuck here with master's. I'm one of a small group, but not the only one. There are even people here with multiple master's--I think one guy has an MBA and an MIS and he still can't get out.

[japester.livejournal.com]

phd to get *out* of tier one?
wtf mate?
i only have half a bachelors and i'm on the way to level 3.
my boss is two units short of a bachelors and he's on twice the pay I am.
egads.
apply for the job. get the higher level experience, then move on to a different company.
It looks like moving laterally inside your current one is going to be ludicrously difficult.
is it worth talking with an HR person about what you want to do, where you want to go in the next few years?

oh and revamp your resume, er, tailor it for the different jobs you are applying for. if removing the tech support references makes it more likely that you'll get an interview it's worth thinking about. though how you'd explain what you've been doing for the last 3.5 years could be intriguing. herding cats, maybe?

[redqueenmeg.livejournal.com]

Coincidentally, I have been herding cats, just not for pay. :)

I talked to one of the HR people here at work a few months ago. He suggested some changes to my resume, which I made, and both he and my boss asked that I notify them before I applied for anything internal. I did that and they both wrote me letters of recommendation.

And I still couldn't even get an interview, let alone the job. :(

[sketchydave.livejournal.com]

Sounds like you're going for the job. Good call.

But man, if they told you to get a PhD it is time to bail out of that company. That is just horrible advice. At your age a PhD will hurt your chances of getting any jobs. Employers will go directly from saying you are underqualified to you are overqualified. Scary, but true.

If you are concerned about not having enough technical experience I would look into getting some technical certificates. Those are good to have because its "proof" that you can administer a server or network. You may not have gotten paid to do it, but you have proof that you can do it.